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Old 03-21-2008, 01:43 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Old 03-21-2008, 03:27 PM   #17 (permalink)
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i could watch that for hours.......
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Old 03-21-2008, 03:33 PM   #18 (permalink)
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i could watch that for hours.......
So that was you in that pic???
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Old 03-26-2008, 03:55 PM   #19 (permalink)
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^^^No Gamma, the FBI themselves stated that this was from their questioning of Saddam himself. Where have you been?
but the UN destroyed most of the WMD's. even in that 60 minutes interview you posted, it said the same. moreover, Iraq was mentioned immediately following the 9/11 attacks. it was Bush's war to begin with, WMDs or no WMDS, Iraq was on the list and 9/11 became the reason.

Chalabi played more of a part in this respect than Saddam's false boasts.

have you been watching this? it's a 2 parter.
FRONTLINE: bush's war | PBS it's a little over 4 hours and you can watch it free online. it reviews the genesis and full history of the five-year U.S. war in Iraq, drawing on fresh reporting and interviews and more than 40 previous Frontline films that have documented the war on terror.

see it!
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Old 03-26-2008, 05:13 PM   #20 (permalink)
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It's just crazy that the US would be involved in a illegal war because in my military classes they talk about the difference between a Just War and Just a War. How our military force is used as a last resort. Maybe these people in charge took a different class than I did.
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Old 03-26-2008, 05:49 PM   #21 (permalink)
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but the UN destroyed most of the WMD's. even in that 60 minutes interview you posted, it said the same. moreover, Iraq was mentioned immediately following the 9/11 attacks. it was Bush's war to begin with, WMDs or no WMDS, Iraq was on the list and 9/11 became the reason.

Chalabi played more of a part in this respect than Saddam's false boasts.

have you been watching this? it's a 2 parter.
FRONTLINE: bush's war | PBS it's a little over 4 hours and you can watch it free online. it reviews the genesis and full history of the five-year U.S. war in Iraq, drawing on fresh reporting and interviews and more than 40 previous Frontline films that have documented the war on terror.

see it!
I understand what you are saying gamma, however the fact remains that Saddam was not complying with UN demands........demands which you put so much stock into. At some point you need to hammer a rogue nation.

While the UN inspectors did express doubt that Saddam had the capability and even the presence of WMD, fact remains that Saddam used WMD's on his own people, so at some point he had access to and used them.

It's tough to second guess things of this nature. At the time difficult decisions need to be made.
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Old 03-26-2008, 06:36 PM   #22 (permalink)
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We'd all be happy if Sadam had gassed everyone, including himself. It would have save us a lot of trouble and lost lives.
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Old 03-27-2008, 01:48 AM   #23 (permalink)
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I understand what you are saying gamma, however the fact remains that Saddam was not complying with UN demands........demands which you put so much stock into. At some point you need to hammer a rogue nation.

While the UN inspectors did express doubt that Saddam had the capability and even the presence of WMD, fact remains that Saddam used WMD's on his own people, so at some point he had access to and used them.

It's tough to second guess things of this nature. At the time difficult decisions need to be made.
Yes Saddam had WMD's, the CIA still has the receipts. However, those WMD's, which were actually chemical weapons, were used during the 1980s against civilians and in the Iran-Iraq War. Still, nearly all of them were destroyed and more importantly, when it was shown that Bush/Cheney had pushed so hard for this war in Iraq, and there were no WMD's at all, it was George Tenet who turned out to be the fall guy.

Tenet and Iraq WMD controversy


According to a report by veteran investigative journalist Bob Woodward in his book Plan of Attack, Tenet privately lent his personal authority to the intelligence reports about weapons of mass destruction (WMDs) in Iraq.[20] At a meeting on December 12, 2002, he assured Bush that the evidence against Saddam Hussein amounted to a "slam dunk case." After several months of refusing to confirm this statement, Tenet later stated that this remark was taken out of context. (Tenet indicated that the comment was made pursuant to a discussion about how to convince the American people to support invading Iraq, and that, in his opinion, the best way to convince the people would be by explaining the dangers posed by Iraq's WMD i.e., the public relations sale of the war via the WMD, according to Tenet, would be a "slam dunk").[21] The search following the 2003 invasion of Iraq by U.S., British and international forces yielded no stockpiles of WMDs, however.

Resignation

Citing "personal reasons," Tenet submitted his resignation to President Bush on June 3, 2004. James Pavitt, his Deputy Director for Operations at the CIA, announced his resignation the following day, leading to speculation that the exit of both senior intelligence officials was related to the controversy over alleged Iraqi WMDs and the decision to go to war. Admiral Stansfield Turner, director of the CIA under President Jimmy Carter, said, "I think the president feels he's in enough trouble that he's got to begin to cast some of the blame for the morass that we are in Iraq on to somebody else and this was one subtle way to do it." (Boston Herald, June 4, 2004) However, Bush voiced support for Tenet's efforts, stating, "George Tenet did a superb job for America. It was a high honor to work with him, and I'm sorry he left." (Reuters, June 5, 2004)
source: George Tenet - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I suppose this that this sort of behavior shouldn't surprise anyone since Bush thinks everyone is doing a terrific job. He gave Tenet a medal of freedom award

what other administration do you know during wartime has had such turnover? Walmart has more stability than this:

CIA Director George Tenet has resigned, but he was subsequently awarded the Medal of Freedom
Secretary of State Collin Powell has resigned.
Secretary of Commerce Donald Evans has resigned.
Agricultural Secretary Ann Veneman has resigned.
Education Secretary Rod Paige has resigned.
Energy Secretary Spencer Abraham has resigned.
Tom Ridge, former director of the Department of Homeland Security has resigned.
Secretary of Health and Human Services Tommy Thompson has resigned.
Secretary of Veteran Affairs Anthony Principi has resigned.
White House Chief of Staff Andrew Card has resigned (fuck him!)
Secretary of the Interior Gale Norton has resigned.
Secretary of Transportation Norman Mineta has resigned.
Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld has resigned.
Attorney General John Ashcroft has resigned.
and his replacement, Attorney General Alberto Gonzales (fuck him too) has resigned.
even the cursed Karl Rove has resigned.
Major Gen. Paul Eaton resigned.
Major Gen. John Batiste resigned.
Lieutenant General Gregory S. Newbold resigned.

and lots of higher ups in the military who knew better than Rumsfeld, Cheney, Rice and Bush!

it's a fucked up war, with lies from the beginning. you really should check out the Frontline documentary unless you find that ignorance is bliss.
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Old 03-27-2008, 02:38 AM   #24 (permalink)
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You missed one gamma...

Sec. of Crack whores and pimps has also resigned.
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Old 03-27-2008, 02:15 PM   #25 (permalink)
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^^^Wait, which one is that? There's more than one.
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Old 03-27-2008, 02:47 PM   #26 (permalink)
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^^^Wait, which one is that? There's more than one.
Well seeing as that the Union of Pimps & Whores of America (UPWA!!!) stick together like glue, I'd say all of em gamma.
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Old 03-27-2008, 03:37 PM   #27 (permalink)
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damn that IS a lot of resignations!!
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Old 03-27-2008, 03:50 PM   #28 (permalink)
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I've been staring at this thing for about 10 minutes and man it puts you in a tance. I like this thing. Is there a way to blow this up and make it your desktop background or your screensaver???
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Old 03-27-2008, 05:37 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Gamma you need to get off your high horse about the Dubyah regime. This sort of stuff has always happened and it always will. You as a history guy should know this (I think you do), you just need to acknowledge it (you don't).

Oh and the turnover.......how about Watergate & Vietnam? Turnover of the highest order.
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Old 03-27-2008, 05:38 PM   #30 (permalink)
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I've been staring at this thing for about 10 minutes and man it puts you in a tance. I like this thing. Is there a way to blow this up and make it your desktop background or your screensaver???
Sorry man I have no idea. You might try and shoot an email out to kloh, maybe beanie. I'm not too up on doing gifs.
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