Dual 2GHz PowerPC G5
1GHz frontside bus
512K L2 cache/processor
512MB DDR400 128-bit SDRAM
Expandable to 8GB SDRAM
160GB Serial ATA
SuperDrive
Three PCI-X Slots
ATI Radeon 9600 Pro
64MB DDR video memory
56K internal modem
It's hideous and their performance numbers are all bullshit.
They used gcc to compile their test programs which totally handicaps the P4 as it ignores much of the processor's feature set while using an updated gcc compiler for the G5. The actual Spec numbers for a Dell P4 3GHz box are in excess of 12000, dwarfing the capabilities of these new machines.
They're gaming scores are laughable too. Check out the specs on the other hardware sites for running Q3 in that config on a 3GHz box. With a 9700pro graphics card, a considerable step down from what they claimed to be using, you should actually get above 400fps. I've no idea what they did to that box to reduce its capabilities so much.
And I'm terrified by the sound of this box at full load. 9 fans is a lot of cooling, especially considering that I can build a box with a couple of panaflos and still be comfortably cool.
persoanlly, being a graphics/video person, I ahev always found the Mac processors to be able to allocate RAM better than any PC can. The fact of the matter is, in real world situations for work alone Mac's out perform PC's 9 out of 10 times.
I understand your point of view, but I already have PC's that can handle my gaming capabilities, I don't need that, I need something that has robust computing power and memory allocation.
For example, I was building a program in Flash, and the FLA's were in excess of 800Mb. A Brand new P4 2.4Ghz Vaio could not open the FLA and woudl crash. A G3 power book with half the ram and half the 1/3rd the processor speed was able to do it. You know why... because the PC could not Allocate ram to run it, the G3 used it's L3 cache to allocate the RAM and run the program.
I totally agree with Semi here. The new numbers are total bullshit and put up against the top notch AMD's or P4 3.06Ghz the MAC would get smoked like it has in the past year after year. Sir, since you are such a big graphics/video person here is an article about MAC vs PC dual done on www.digitalvideoediting.com. http://www.digitalvideoediting.com/2...w_macvspc2.htm Check it out...in every single test the MAC gets smoked by both the AMD AND the INTEL time after time like it has in every test. On the last page of that benchmark duel they test them again using Intels new 3.06Ghz and MAC's fastest out. This time is was a slaughter. I personally have never used a MAC nor ever will but from what I have seen and read PC's are always faster time and time again. I can't wait for a benchmark duel with this new MAC and the fastest PC's out so it can get smoked time and time again. []
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">persoanlly, being a graphics/video person, I ahev always found the Mac processors to be able to allocate RAM better than any PC can.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever as the processor isn't involved at all in allocating RAM. That's an issue of the memory controller or the OS depending on to what you're refering. Your statement is still inaccurate though as the Mac OS hasn't had protected memory until OSX, something Windows, BeOS, Unix, Linux, et alia have had for a decade.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">The fact of the matter is, in real world situations for work alone Mac's out perform PC's 9 out of 10 times.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
This is an improveable statement. What real world situations? What work? And what are these 9 out of 10 tries?
Prove your ascertion, my friend.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I understand your point of view, but I already have PC's that can handle my gaming capabilities, I don't need that, I need something that has robust computing power and memory allocation.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I still have no idea where you're getting this memory allocation idea.
I'm assuming this is what you mean by "robust computing":
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">For example, I was building a program in Flash, and the FLA's were in excess of 800Mb. A Brand new P4 2.4Ghz Vaio could not open the FLA and woudl crash. A G3 power book with half the ram and half the 1/3rd the processor speed was able to do it. You know why...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Flash is a crappy format and the software to make it is crap. There are a million reasons a program can crash. Assuming it's the computer's ability to allocate memory is simply the result of too much time under OS9 and System8 as the memory subsystems of those OSes were so bad that they were responsible for 99% of their problems.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">because the PC could not Allocate ram to run it, <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Prove it.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">the G3 used it's L3 cache to allocate the RAM and run the program.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
What on earth are you talking about?
Cache's don't allocate RAM, the OS does. The L3 cache is just temporary holding for information currently in use.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Semi On
It's hideous and their performance numbers are all bullshit.
They used gcc to compile their test programs which totally handicaps the P4 as it ignores much of the processor's feature set while using an updated gcc compiler for the G5. The actual Spec numbers for a Dell P4 3GHz box are in excess of 12000, dwarfing the capabilities of these new machines.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
OK Semi, now you're way off base here. I agree that to some this may look hideous, but some people think the G is ugly too. Besides, when was the last time you saw something original on the PC side?
Looks aside, I'm sure the numbers are just as acurate when the PC folks compare their systems to Macs. It's the same deal in any industry. McDonalds says they're better than Burger King don't they?
I'm really curious as to when you last used a Mac because you seem to have a really distorted view of them. I personally use both, a Mac at home by choice, and a PC at work because I'm at a large corporation that like many other, has an IT staff full of people that don't know Macs and are therefore scared of them. I run most of the same applications at home than I do at work except for all of the Apple apps and Outlook on Windows. And my Mac at home (867 Mhz/G4) runs faster and more efficiently than the PC (1.8 Ghz/P4) at work hands down. I have to restart my PC at least once a week because of crashes or freezes and my Mac hasn't crashed once since I installed OS X a year and a half ago.
Then you say Macromedia Flash is Crap? I know that you know your electronics, but you have no idea what you're talking about when it comes to computers and the internet if you think Flash is crap. Never in the history of computers has a technology been so widely accepted and embraced by not only the people that develop the content, but also by the end user. What web animation software is better?
Chaz, I really hope you don't believe everything you read. Why would you chose to discredit the numbers put out by Apple, but chose to accept the numbers put out by a digital video magazine? Do you know them to be more credible, or are you just chosing to believe the one that favors your platform. If you've never used one how can you back up your statements? The last company I worked at had a $20K Windows video editing system. I brought in my $3k Mac to give them a demo, and they were so blown away that they bought their first ever Mac. The only thing they were worried about was integration. In less than 15 minutes, I had it on the network communicating with all PCs, printers, email, etc. It really is that easy.
You really shouldn't discredit something you know absolutely nothing about. Let's wait for the independant tests to come out and we'll see who comes out on top. There's nothing I can't do on a Mac that you can do on a PC, but there's plenty I can do on a Mac that can't be done on a PC.
'03 AT Sedan | Brilliant Silver | Willow Leather | Sport | Premium | Aerokit w/Spoiler | Nav
Well Lead I agree with you in the aspect that I can't discredit something I have never used. I also don't believe EVERYTHING I read but come on Lead...test after test from gaming to video editing and such prove that PC's run faster than MAC's. Now more stable I have no idea. Please show me ANY article that proves me wrong where the tests lean toward the MAC side when it comes to how fast a computer runs. Now did you read the ORIGINAL post topic of this thread? I believe he stated how fast the new MACS are didn't he? I believe his original quote was, "The fact of the matter is, in real world situations for work alone Mac's out perform PC's 9 out of 10 times." and this statement is just flat out NOT TRUE! PC's out-perform MACS on EVERY LEVEL. I may not know web-design like you so I can't comment on the Flash situation, BUT I do know about building PC's and hardware.
So maybe I need to re-phrase my last statement. It is not that I don't believe the numbers put out by Apple, BUT I do not believe it is the fastest running computer out on the market!!! You can't just say oh cause this comp has dual 2Ghz processors it is faster than any PC's out...that is why we have the benchmark testing to help us determine in EVERYDAY USE such as gaming, accessing office and photoshop and such which is faster. I have YET to see in the past recent years a MAC faster than a PC.
Well I for one ain't ashamed to admit I'm 100% biased against Apple. It all began back in the day when I had a Commodore 64 and a friend had an Apple and always bragged it up. I think IBM makes some really great CPU's, but as long as they're in a Mac I will never own one. Same way with Intel, will probably never buy a Pentium CPU either. What's the logic in that you say? Not much I admit, but I'll stick to supporting the technologies and companies I like (for whatever hair-brained reason I have). There's so many choices avaialable today that we can all afford to do just that.
I'm not a Mac or Intel basher, because I think competition is great and moves the industry forward at a much faster rate than a single monopolizing company ever would. Without Apple, M$, Intel, AMD, and a myriad of other vendors, the PC industry would be in shambles. We might be like IBM envsioned a long time ago with everybody sharing timeslices on one of the 3 or 4 huge supercomputers in world. [xx(]
Still, I don't agree with most of you Macolites. I haven't had much experience behind one, but I did recently talk to a highly respected photographer who was making the transistion to the digital world a while back. All his friends told him to get a Mac "because they do graphics best". So he originally bought a Mac, but had just sold it for a new PC when I talked to him. He told me that what they claim is simply not true. His Mac was much slower, less stable, and didn't have all the tools that are available on his new PC. He also said they were way overpriced. Most other Mac people I talk to just proclaim how easy it is to use, or how they like the styling [dunno], but that's a moot point with me as I'm very computer literate and don't care much for looks. I prefer the sheek almunim cases anyday (but I'm a cheapskate and won't buy one).
I personally have a powerbook G4 and when it first came out it was totally off the hook..This thing was insanly fast! Very fast in rendering graphics and now with this G5 it is truly the fastest computer out there since its the only 64 bit computer..all the PCs run at 32 bits..this is totaly a huge step for macintosh.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">OK Semi, now you're way off base here. I agree that to some this may look hideous, but some people think the G is ugly too. Besides, when was the last time you saw something original on the PC side? <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
How can I be off base on my aesthetic opinion of something. I assure you I really do find it hideous. Whether you agree with me or not is irrelevent.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Looks aside, I'm sure the numbers are just as acurate when the PC folks compare their systems to Macs. It's the same deal in any industry. McDonalds says they're better than Burger King don't they?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Some of us aren't Mac folks or PC folks and as such are capable of independent and unbiased measurement utilizing the scientific method. If you're unfamiliar with the reputation of the larger computer enthusiast sites, I can link you to several which are well known by both the Mac and the PC world as sources for REAL figures free from marketing BS.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I'm really curious as to when you last used a Mac because you seem to have a really distorted view of them.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Show me where.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I personally use both, a Mac at home by choice, and a PC at work because I'm at a large corporation that like many other, has an IT staff full of people that don't know Macs and are therefore scared of them.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Or the Apple Price Premium is difficult for already financially strapped IT departments to justify, but your Mac Fanboydom can generate whatever reason you like.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> I run most of the same applications at home than I do at work except for all of the Apple apps and Outlook on Windows. And my Mac at home (867 Mhz/G4) runs faster and more efficiently than the PC (1.8 Ghz/P4) at work hands down.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I don't know your configuration and therefore can not comment on what deficiencies your hardware and software may demonstrate. Anecdotes are not data.
All independent Benchmarks indicate you're wrong.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I have to restart my PC at least once a week because of crashes or freezes and my Mac hasn't crashed once since I installed OS X a year and a half ago.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
What OS? If you're running an NT based core (2K or XP) and you're being forced to reboot, you need to talk to your IT department because you have a problem.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Then you say Macromedia Flash is Crap?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Go to any computer enthusiast site on the planet and ask the audience there what they think of Flash.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I know that you know your electronics, but you have no idea what you're talking about when it comes to computers and the internet if you think Flash is crap.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Never in the history of computers has a technology been so widely accepted and embraced by not only the people that develop the content, but also by the end user. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Ethernet
GUI
Mouse
Laser printing
.pdf
Crappy and slow interface replacements hardly make for compelling and necessary content.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">What web animation software is better?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I would argue that a lack of web animation in the first place is better.
I KNOW that their figures are wrong because every non-Apple source for the hardware they tested has found significantly better performance on the x86 side.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">There's nothing I can't do on a Mac that you can do on a PC, but there's plenty I can do on a Mac that can't be done on a PC.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I want to run Lasi on the Mac. How about PSpice? MathCAD? Shit, Battlefield 1942?
There's plenty that can't be done on one or the other. You sound like a mindless fanboy. Both systems are nothing but tools despite whatever fervent religious zeal you may hold toward your computer. At some tasks a Mac is superior and at some a PC is superior. Your wild claims are a bit absurd.
ok, so this was not ment to be a bashing contest, but before you go calling me a Mac person I will tell you... I have never ever owned one. Now you will tell me I can't judge because of this fact. However, I have been exposed to Mac in many different situations. I am a diehard PC guy and 2 years ago, I would have told any Mac lover to shove it and give me a PC. That said, my roomate purchased a G3 iBook a year back, and I have numerous friends with mac products, as well as using G4's for High Def editing at college. If I had the choice between a Mac or a PC for video editing, I woudl in fact choose a PC, but not any old PC. The only PC's I have found to truly compete with the Mac G4's are in a much higher price range than the normal consumer computers. The likes of SGI's Octane would be on my list well above a G4.
The statements I made were vauge since I did not think this would get full blown, those of you who have read my other posts know that I am a long winded person and tend to give a complete explaination. I will continue with this in the morning, but right now it is 1AM and I have work at 8AM, so we will finish later..
I am not a stubborn person, if I can be proven wrong, then I will accept the truth.
Well Lead I agree with you in the aspect that I can't discredit something I have never used. I also don't believe EVERYTHING I read but come on Lead...test after test from gaming to video editing and such prove that PC's run faster than MAC's.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Let's not forget that the majority of these tests are run by PC users that don't know jack about the Mac.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> Now more stable I have no idea. Please show me ANY article that proves me wrong where the tests lean toward the MAC side when it comes to how fast a computer runs. Now did you read the ORIGINAL post topic of this thread? I believe he stated how fast the new MACS are didn't he?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Yes, he did. The G5 was just announced today. They haven't even been released yet. Like I said before, let's wait for the independant tests to come back.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I believe his original quote was, "The fact of the matter is, in real world situations for work alone Mac's out perform PC's 9 out of 10 times." and this statement is just flat out NOT TRUE!<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
This is Milt's statement, he can back up his own remarks.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">PC's out-perform MACS on EVERY LEVEL.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
BS. How can you even say that when you've never used a Mac??? Show me any video camera or digital camera you can hook up to a PC without having to load a driver. On a Mac, you plug it in via firewire or USB and it works, period. Another example, try to go download some software and see what your options are: Do you need the Windows 95, Windows 98, Windows NT, Windows 2000, Windows XP version or the Mac version that works on all Macs?
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I may not know web-design like you so I can't comment on the Flash situation, BUT I do know about building PC's and hardware.
So maybe I need to re-phrase my last statement. It is not that I don't believe the numbers put out by Apple, BUT I do not believe it is the fastest running computer out on the market!!! You can't just say oh cause this comp has dual 2Ghz processors it is faster than any PC's out...that is why we have the benchmark testing to help us determine in EVERYDAY USE such as gaming, accessing office and photoshop and such which is faster. I have YET to see in the past recent years a MAC faster than a PC.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Any misconceptions you have about the Mac, I can prove you wrong on. I invite you over to my house at any time for a demo. My Mac is 2 years old, and I can guarantee you I can keep up with your system. It won't blow yours away like the new G5 can, but that would be like saying "my P4 can blow away your P3", not exactly the best comparison, which by the way is what digital video magazine did. And seriously, games on PC's and Macs are both fast. Can the human eye really see 400 fps? I think not. Let's not forget that games such as Quake were written originally for PCs then ported to the Mac. Which version do you think will be faster?
'03 AT Sedan | Brilliant Silver | Willow Leather | Sport | Premium | Aerokit w/Spoiler | Nav
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Semi On
How can I be off base on my aesthetic opinion of something. I assure you I really do find it hideous. Whether you agree with me or not is irrelevent.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I was refering to your post in general being off base.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Some of us aren't Mac folks or PC folks and as such are capable of independent and unbiased measurement utilizing the scientific method. If you're unfamiliar with the reputation of the larger computer enthusiast sites, I can link you to several which are well known by both the Mac and the PC world as sources for REAL figures free from marketing BS.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I beg to differ that you're a so-called independent. What machine are you posting from?
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Show me where.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Throughout your entire post and again in your last one. I'm showing you now.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Or the Apple Price Premium is difficult for already financially strapped IT departments to justify, but your Mac Fanboydom can generate whatever reason you like.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Another general statement made by someone who's not familiar with the Mac platform. If you think Macs are more expensive, prove it to me. Find me a Windows machine from a major vendor that comes with everything the top of the line Mac comes with and show me your price difference.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I don't know your configuration and therefore can not comment on what deficiencies your hardware and software may demonstrate. Anecdotes are not data.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
It would be an anecdote if it was just me that made this observation.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">All independent Benchmarks indicate you're wrong.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I'll find you several that will prove you wrong. Like I said in my post to Chaz, most "independent" benchmarks are done by PC users that don't know how to use a Mac.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">What OS? If you're running an NT based core (2K or XP) and you're being forced to reboot, you need to talk to your IT department because you have a problem.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Every one of them. I've been using PCs since 95 and always run into the same problems. I know I'm not the only one since I read about this all the time. Blue screen of death ring a bell?
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Go to any computer enthusiast site on the planet and ask the audience there what they think of Flash.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Not sure where you're going, but I've never been to a site where I can address their audience
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">http://www.arstechnica.com<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
That's ironic since this is a quote from their homepage:
"Performance is competitive with Dual Xeon Dell PC, lots of SPEC, Mathematica, Photoshop tests put the new top-end machine in front."
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Ethernet
GUI
Mouse
Laser printing
.pdf
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
All of these have been well received and adapted, but none as fast and as widely as Flash.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Crappy and slow interface replacements hardly make for compelling and necessary content.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
So if it were up to you, the internet would be all black text on white backgrounds right?
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I would argue that a lack of web animation in the first place is better.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I'll partially agree with you here since I know the tool in the wrong hands can create some really ugly crap, but that's why design should be left to the designers.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I KNOW that their figures are wrong because every non-Apple source for the hardware they tested has found significantly better performance on the x86 side.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
That's shocking since this machine was just announced today and won't even be released until September, so I doubt every non-Apple source has one to test.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I want to run Lasi on the Mac. How about PSpice? MathCAD? Shit, Battlefield 1942?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
>>G5 faster than a G35!!!
]