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damn i feel like someone hit me on the head man! wth is this doing here, again?
no... the old G35 got about 235 hp to wheels. this adds another ~50 so you are getting about 287 hp to wheels. The loss ratio has decreased with the new frame/chassis.
so G35 engine output 293 hp 235 of which made it to wheels.
G37 engine output 330 hp 287 of which made it to wheels
this is less than the hp loss percentage of the 335i, but 335 will kick butt with the 299.81 lb/ft of torque TO THE WHEELS
i thought one of the dyno charts said the G37 put down 299.81 torque
both these cars are so understated that it isnt even funny....i could see being off 15hp more or less...but shit the 335i is producing 60 more HP than BMW states and the G37 nearly 35HP more than press releases.
Don't get your hopes up for final power rating too far from the suggested 330hp. The official Nissan press release stated 330hp estimated. "Estimated" as standard disclaimer prior to final certification. Nissan is a company not known for underrating their claims historically. BMW on the other is know for NOT overrating theirs.
The '07 G35 dyno Automobile Magazine provided for comparison appeared to have been mistaken for the older "non rev-up" VQ35DE w. 6600rpm redline and 275hp SAE factory rating.
If we must play the drivetrain loss voodoo magic game, then it ought to look more like the following:
VQ37VHR
Automobile Dynojet rating: 287hp
assuming the particular '08 G35 coupe has similar drivetrain loss @ ~14.2%
--> calculated crank/flywheel power = ~334hp SAE
Coincidence (to the preliminary factory 330hp rating)? Not likely, especially given the +/-3% precision at play for typical chassis dynos.
*Note: based on revised SAE power measurement rating and certification (not to be confused with SAE dyno corrections).
The fact of the matter is modern manual transmission typically do not give up much more than 10% in efficiency. 4-5% of lost from tire to Dynojet roller interface is not uncommon.
btw, G37 is well over 3600 lbs with the top sport model pushing 3668 lbs. as per Nissan's official record.
Don't get your hopes up for final power rating too far from the suggested 330hp. The official Nissan press release stated 330hp estimated. "Estimated" as standard disclaimer prior to final certification. Nissan is a company not known for underrating their claims historically. BMW on the other is know for NOT overrating theirs.
The '07 G35 dyno Automobile Magazine provided for comparison appeared to have been mistaken for the older "non rev-up" VQ35DE w. 6600rpm redline and 275hp SAE factory rating.
If we must play the drivetrain loss voodoo magic game, then it ought to look more like the following:
VQ37VHR
Automobile Dynojet rating: 287hp
assuming the particular '08 G35 coupe has similar drivetrain loss @ ~14.2%
--> calculated crank/flywheel power = ~334hp SAE
Coincidence (to the preliminary factory 330hp rating)? Not likely, especially given the +/-3% precision at play for typical chassis dynos.
*Note: based on revised SAE power measurement rating and certification (not to be confused with SAE dyno corrections).
The fact of the matter is modern manual transmission typically do not give up much more than 10% in efficiency. 4-5% of lost from tire to Dynojet roller interface is not uncommon.
btw, G37 is well over 3600 lbs with the top sport model pushing 3668 lbs. as per Nissan's official record.
The factor that you are calculating .14 for drivetrain loss in our cheap as 350Z's/G35's is laughable...its probably right at the average of .2
both these cars are so understated that it isnt even funny....i could see being off 15hp more or less...but shit the 335i is producing 60 more HP than BMW states and the G37 nearly 35HP more than press releases.
I THINK you guys are misunderstanding the numbers. They assumed that the G35 engine was really putting out the advertised 298 and with the measurement to the wheel as 235, that's a 20+% loss in the drivetrain. Assuming the same drivetrain losses, the new G37 engine puts out 350 hp+. At the end of the day, what makes it to the ground counts, and the G37 puts down a max of 287 HP compared to 235 for the DE engine. 287 is 87% of 330 HP rating. With the new SAE standard, I've been seeing other cars with around the same percentage of power to the ground (about 85%). The G35 engine might have just been "over-rated" and as such had what looked to be 22% losses.
Regardless, all that matters is what makes it to the ground. Trying to back out numbers to see what the engine does is useless as it's not hitting the ground anyway.
The factor that you are calculating .14 for drivetrain loss in our cheap as 350Z's/G35's is laughable...its probably right at the average of .2
Don't hate the number, hate the game. Cheap or not, the G/Z manual transmission and rear differential are out soured to third parties whom also supply for various other car manufacturers, including ones that are far costlier. Welcome to 21-century technology. 80% efficiency (20% loss) *is* the "laughable" figure in the engineering industry I know so well and happend to work in.
The 14% combined figure was derived straight out of Automobile Magazine and official Nissan publications (236hp @ wheel, 275 @ crank). What more does one ask really? Still I warn of what I termed "voodoo magic" when one tries to replicate drivetrain loss outside of a well controlled environment; Dynojet rigs being one of the worst in this regard.
I THINK you guys are misunderstanding the numbers. They assumed that the G35 engine was really putting out the advertised 298 and with the measurement to the wheel as 235, that's a 20+% loss in the drivetrain. Assuming the same drivetrain losses, the new G37 engine puts out 350 hp+. At the end of the day, what makes it to the ground counts, and the G37 puts down a max of 287 HP compared to 235 for the DE engine. 287 is 87% of 330 HP rating. With the new SAE standard, I've been seeing other cars with around the same percentage of power to the ground (about 85%). The G35 engine might have just been "over-rated" and as such had what looked to be 22% losses.
Regardless, all that matters is what makes it to the ground. Trying to back out numbers to see what the engine does is useless as it's not hitting the ground anyway.
There was an error made by Automobile magazine. The data shown for the alledged 2007 G35 coupe is in fact that of the older "non rev-up VQ35DE", which Nissan officially rated at 275hp SAE. Once that is noted, the numbers actually worked out quite reasonably.
Earlier Nissan claims prior to the new SAE testing standard were in fact optimistic - as clearly shown by some retractment from Nissan. These optimisms, not limited only to Nissan, is what supported much of the false presumption that 20% or greater is the norm for modern drivetrain loss.
You've got the right attitude what makes it to the ground is ultimately what really matters. Whichever way one looks at it, the VQ37VHR triumph over the 1st generation VQ35DE by at least 50hp.
^^^ Makes alot of sense. I wish they would have dyno'd a 3.5 HR engine so we can see any improvements over that engine.
At the end of the day, about 50 more HP over my 04 but an add of about 300 lbs. Slightly more aggressive final gear ratio as well but taller wheels. Should be noticeably quicker at least compared to the 04s. Maybe just a tick or two quicker than the 07 sedan.
Don't hate the number, hate the game. Cheap or not, the G/Z manual transmission and rear differential are out soured to third parties whom also supply for various other car manufacturers, including ones that are far costlier. Welcome to 21-century technology. 80% efficiency (20% loss) *is* the "laughable" figure in the engineering industry I know so well and happend to work in.
The 14% combined figure was derived straight out of Automobile Magazine and official Nissan publications (236hp @ wheel, 275 @ crank). What more does one ask really? Still I warn of what I termed "voodoo magic" when one tries to replicate drivetrain loss outside of a well controlled environment; Dynojet rigs being one of the worst in this regard.
Here is what i am saying, Porsches, for example are known to have a single digit amount of drivetrain loss. That why you get a 3200lbs Carrera S, with 355 hp and 295lbs trq run the same quarter mile time as a 3100lbs Corvette with 400hp and 400lbs trq. BMW and Ferrari are also known to have sub 15% loss as well. Dont put G's into this category. But when it all comes down to it, all that matters is what touches the ground.
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